tv Book Discussion on In a Different Key CSPAN February 14, 2016 6:30pm-7:16pm EST
the strikes and mexican-americans were a majority of the workers at the plant in the california history. >> one of the problems with the federal reserve bank in the wilson administration was decentralized roosevelt wasn't a fan of thinkers so how did he reconcile and i think if i recall correct late it became a central bank during the administrations of how do you reconcile that with the attempts
it shows the political acclimate it to threaten the bank of new york if he didn't get his way. later, roosevelt appointed him to be the chairman of the federal reserve board in the reforms and he remains the chairman right through the rest of the presidency and he was a banker from utah who had come to a kind of views sort of by himself as a banker in the west who had begun as a republican but have come to realize in this crisis one needed to act quite firmly said he had come around to roosevelt's point of view and supported the policy and the
what's great about it is there is a lot of individuals against the system which is very moving and very real. so it is a great read. congratulations. >> there's a lot of things about the book that that it fascinates me but why don't we start where you started which is how you both got interested in it and what led you to it and a little bit about your relationship not together but to abc and how this became a big story for you. >> i had autism and not long after that i figured out i needed to do something to try to help us understand it better.
we were a team of journalists working together. >> you saw your kid as a story right away? >> jaundice all my paid as a story right away. we were doing this program 40 hours a week, four hours of speech, we were going to beat us this because we thought that it was beatable and for some people, it is so it is a day in the life is pretty intense and it would have been a great addition. i said as long as i'm not in it. so we decided to do a story on the treatment he was receiving at the time and show that it didn't help all children but it
did help some and sort of the whole idea was that his one-word words and we got abc news, not the main abc news, that's nice line. he said nobody was talking about autism and 2000. they have maybe seen rain man and had the sense that they heard of it but it wasn't going to be a story or relevant to the broad audience. there is such an enormous part of the narrative. there is a lot of stories that come along and the families that are dealing with one or another issue like that and we work with them all the time and they had that sort of profile the track is that they were inside of abc and kept pushing and pushing
until they said yes. >> but the way the book begins, he was the first person diagnosed with autism. tell us a little bit about how you got to find him and develop that. >> we decided we needed to do something that would be more everlasting and really dig into the history of autism and -- >> we learned through the grapevine through the literature wasn't diagnosed until 1943. they were still living somewhere in the united states these many years later and by looking for
the clues in the reports that were written in the 1930s and 1940s, we found out the town was living in a mississippi. we knew his first name was donald but in the literature they only gave the last name so care care and who is a superb. >> a number of donald's but not many. one day i called and i got an answering machine and the machine picks up and says hello and i hope you are having a happy spring spring and you should have a happy fall and a happy christmas. have a wonderful 2007. i hung up the phone and i said i
know it's him. [laughter] at the beginning part of the story was very severely limited in the stability to communicate and relate to people. he paid them no attention and the language was from the word e-echo if you said something to him rather than answer he would repeat the question over and over again and that is a rather classic sign for some people and then you go forward to the present day it was astounding. we got down there and we found a man after she will tell you in a minute a little bit of resistance we met in the community.
they are still definitely autism that he had grown, mature and flourished spectacularly and we think that is because of him and he is inherent potential but also because of what happened to him in that little town. >> mississippi and raised donald. you could also say that he came from a wealthy family. he was well respected because there was the banker's son. >> it's not just -- it is more complicated than that. he had all of the perfect elements and he had a family
respected in the community and they embraced him so much when we came down the first time to the story we were told by people they bitterly sort of lecture to us if we messed with him, they would become the track us down because nobody messed with them. people supported him. >> what happened as he grew up as this idea took hold and he began -- his mother used her influence to get where. to get space on the nearby farm where she spent a couple of years just being able to wander and have structure. the donald ended up getting into high school and by that time you see the floor rushing personality.
always about three years behind everybody else but the kids you would expect them to be bullied and teased. we talk with people and they thought he was kind of a genius. that was like the smartest kid in the school. he had that weird mathematical thing. >> there's a there is a story about him counting all of the bricks in the entire store. actually what was great is that the story -- is a legend that -- >> how many bricks are in the sight of the school building? >> 4,362.
>> and they ran off and told their friends. they said the tell us the bricks story. so he told us and he said he hadn't counted them that they he just wanted them to like him. the way that his potential was realized at an amazing fashion. it was to think about children the children who we think of today as having autism.
to talk about the notion that somehow it is your fault if you are the parent or if you institutionalize or moveon i'm sure you didn't know before you started. >> there was the interesting thing. >> they have fragments of things here and there. until 1970 or so when a mom took her child to an expert and said what's going on with my china but the answer was you did this by failing to love the child
enough and karen has met some of the others who experience this today who are in their 80s and some in new york in fact did you spend hours with them and i will stop talking because the part that really impressed me it took hours because it was still there even though they didn't believe it anymore. >> if you are a mother this is one of the stories that it's just heartbreaking as here you are already living this life doing everything you can to help the child so different and so complicated and so disabled and bound you are being blamed for it. it's it took her a while to get the diagnosis and then she tried to find a place to get some kind of treatment. they were doing some treatment in the hospital she was able to
get her son into. you needed to be analyzed and discussed what you did to cause autism. rita was an educated woman and who knows a lot about psychology and had read the book and she knew this is my fault so i had to figure out what to do. so she is sitting with her psychologist and she tells the story after almost three hours of talking. she hadn't told the stories for years or decades and she tells the story to me where she says i'm sitting there and all of a sudden i got it. i am member.
he was jaundiced and yellow and i thought he's like a little chicken and i caused his autism and she deleted it because everybody else be needed and it was a tragedy at the time that it was your fault. if you are a parent and have a child with autism the first thing you think is what can i do to help him? if it is my thought maybe fault maybe i actually can help them and so this went on and on and on. >> it is so complex because you can possibly help your child and so the issue is that it can be subtle so if you are going to be like the other characters in the book and you decide to try to get rid of everything else and devote your time to helping the
child reach his or her potential potential that is a lot to ask so in a way you are being told that this is the only way to go forward and i think that's the whole question of parenting today. we now live in a world this is where the story brightens somewhat we now live in a world that has been created by things that took place in the 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s by parents who decided to stand up to this attitude and it had other manifestations. the shame of that was associated was so powerful the parents were told routinely to send their kids away to institutions. they were told to put the children away and try to move on and try to develop their activities.
>> doctor spock said to do that. we were stunned to find in page 549 in the first edition of the book recommendation that is the recommendation that is in the maternity ward weaver some evidence. it even said how the conversation with the father because the mother is probably going to try to fight it. many parents did send their children to institutions not because they couldn't handle the burden but because the pressure and the shame or so intends to veto in tents they were being told you are doing the right thing but they couldn't handle the child. >> some of them would be so difficult and not everybody is
necessarily up to that. that didn't exist yet. >> where do you send your child? the school system legally says we don't want you here. >> until the 70s when the legislation was passed in which the federal government said if you want the money you never turn away the child. >> that is the whole story of the history of autism in so many ways is about parental love. >> that's why we are where we are today.
he has been completely discredited today that it was a pretty painful process. >> there are people in the room who know and for those of you that don't, he was the doctor phil and doctor awes of his day but it was all about psychology and psychiatry he was given advice on television and in the movies and magazines. >> he wasn't really doctor anything. he was an art history. >> said he was a good show man. >> he convinced him that he was a psychologist, psychiatrist and he was given charge of the school that became the neck for the miracles that he was
bringing about supposedly in the treatment of children with autism. the theme is repeatedly he talks about a girl that is obsessed with the weather. children and adults are often obsessed, they become obsessed with her it her at his train schedules or the model t.. this girl was obsessed with the weather and he actually wrote. if you break it up it actually says we ate her and the girl was terrified of being devoured by her mother so that's why she was obsessed with the weather.
the praise was astounding. everybody bought into this thing about him that he was a genius. it was a sounding so that's what the mothers were up against. and the rest saying he was a genius. >> said the scientific establishment was so wrong everybody took it seriously. one of the things i admire is when you tell the story you don't come out with that argument. they can be quite helpful. >> there was very little done
and to families come independently when another created in the organization to study the science. the researchers don't go to study something if there is no money in it and they raise money and login and then tie your field of scientists who now research autism. >> one of the things that struck me about the book is we are sitting here talking about a disease and we don't know what they are. from what i understand there are no medical indicators so it's a kind of setup trait that we ascribe and there's disagreement about it. >> how we define autism has been a moving target at the edges from the very beginning. the definitions that are in the
textbooks have been changed repeatedly and that has many repercussions. it makes it difficult to know if there is more autism than there used to be because we are comparing apples and oranges and it is often cited that it used to be 4.5 children per 10,000. we found out where that number comes from. you throw the numbers are out and say where do they come from and even the experts aren't sure where they got the numbers. it comes from a study done by a man in london who was given an assignment as a junior researcher to come up with statistics which is a part of london and they wanted to find out how much they should deliver so they said to find out what the rate is a.
of over once and bumps. his problem was when he went to the textbook to say here's the definition i'm looking for, there was none. there were all kinds of conflicting discussions so he constructed his own checklist and he came up with a count and it came up to about 60 people with greater severity to last and then at a certain point they drew the line halfway down.
those of above have autism and those below don't. he was very honest. it's arbitrary. this came out of his statistic at 4.5 out of 10,000 in this place in england and they had autism and so that's the baseline. i don't think studying the prevalence makes much sense until we figure out the definition until it keeps moving. >> what we need to do is provide services and help create fulfilling lives. we feel that it is the essence.
>> it took place in new jersey and there was a young man with autism on the verge of adulthood he didn't have language and he began making noises and began rocking and flipping his fingers in front of his face and this really agitated the two sitting behind him so they leaned in and gave him a sort of what's with you, what's your problem with? ..
>> if i were to summarize is there any plan or scheme in place to put together people with complementary skills so that they make a good team. the answer is not exactly, but sort of. people are beginning to recognize that individuals with autism, particularly if they are people who are at that part of the spectrum where they are capable of independence, that part of the spectrum with real creativity and talent and sometime genius emerges. people at that part of the spectrum were can be found for them and there is a man in denmark who we profile replete in the book. he started a little company called the specialist, he has a son with autism and took out a mortgage on his house and started a company to prove that individuals with autistic traits actually have economic
value. it sounds coldhearted but he was anything but coldhearted. what he was saying was having a job a job as a way to independence in life. he started this company where he hires almost exclusively people who have autism. he uses their talents for memory, for for small details, for understanding patterns to actually test software. he knows however they do not do very well with job interviews so he has a workaround with that. >> he spread it over europe and he is trying to spread it in this country. >> well you miss my job interview q2. he has a a hard time doing job interview so instead of sitting down where people have difficulty making eye contact, he gives them lego assignments. he puts together teams of people and wants to see how they work as a team and so in his office they have this big room with a sandbox. that is the job interview room.
[inaudible] [inaudible] >> sure, right now the autism is called the spectrum. within that spectrum are people who are severely disabled and struggle with everything from talking to being able, to banging her head against the wall, to doing anything even mildly independent. at the very end of the spectrum can be a college professor who just has problems of social skills. or could be someone who has their phd and is bagging groceries because they cannot figure out how to have a job. we keep changing the definition of autism. probably there are many on that
spectrum and we find different types of people who would fit different holes. right now the the spectrum is so huge that it is hard to compare the two ends. >> the positive of the spectrum however, his services. if you can get diagnosis of autism, particularly because apparent activism who put autism on the agenda over the last 35 years and for schools to do something about autism. the diagnosis has meaning and clout to getting services. [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible]
[inaudible] >> so you are asking about a film called visitors and jabber's with our two men traveling around the world were not able to speak using spoken language. they can indicate through typing. we have not met those gentlemen. so we cannot comment on that. the question of people who cannot speak, finding other ways to communicate is actually a tangled one and the story of autism and something we visit. there's no question today that you can go to a lot of schools and the ipad has been a revolutionary development for children who cannot communicate verbally but you can see them working with symbols and creating a basic grammar. that takes over from a system that has been in place for many years called text which is the
picture exchange communication system they were taught to hand pictures of things and take things back and return them. that that was also kind of grammar of its own. if you go back to the sixties, there was a woman who harnessed a machine called the talking typewriter. there's a huge thing about the size of a refrigerator hooked up to tape recorders. if you. if you pushed kia voice would speak. the attempt to get people to be able to speak has always been there. it has always been controversial because suddenly the language that emerges from people particularly nobody bothered to teach them to read her white right, suddenly they were producing incredibly eloquent language, and perceptive thoughts but there were a scandal associated there is enthusiasm for a process.
>> and we tell that story in our book. i'm not sure if the book is just out so not sure if you have read it. >> is a shocking story just tell it quickly. >> the quick version is that a teacher who says that she was facilitating for a young woman with autism said the young woman, her family, her father and brother were raping and abusing her. >> we need to explain what it means to facilitate come i don't think it's clear. a child was in front of a table with a keyboard and that child hand might wander around and it was found that when a facilitator supported that hand, perhaps held it like this the child independently was dead eight and reassured by that i began to type out coherent language, may be roughly in the beginning but better and better with practice.
it was understood and asserted that this language was coming from the child and the facilitator was merely a steady year the process. out of this came astounding language from people who have never been taught to read or write. part of what happened as the media went nuts over this, the new york times, primetime live, the television show did major stories about the miracle of this communication. emerging from the children and adults. then, all of a sudden at one place after another the messages that began to emerge work, my my father touched me inappropriately, my father raped me, an astounding number of assertions of sexual abuse were taking place. the father's were almost always and sometimes the mothers and siblings were arrested and held on charges of sexual abuse, sexual assaults.
based on this testimony that came through this process, this is when the process finally got a real test because there were defense attorneys who brought in experts. you can tell what is happening as it is devastating. >> in the particular story we were talking about, a lawyer brought in an expert who studies communication between people who have autism. he had a very simple plan to be able to test if it was real or not, that was on one side the person who had autism was a pitcher and on the other side the facilitator would see a picture. if the facilitator and the person she was typing foresaw the same picture and have the same answer we knew they were communicating. in every single instant, when the person with autism saw photo and the facilitator saw something else they typed the
wrong thing. they had not seen the picture. it was a black and white test that this person -- i want to back up a little bit because i do think the facilitators it was not malicious, they were not trying to do something awful to these families. they believe these children voice was coming through them and they were delusional. i'm afraid that there is a lot of that. it stopped after the stories got out in the nineties. 1010 years later we would hear about stories where people would be in jail because their child had accused them of murder, i'm sorry of rape. it's all about hope a. >> it's interesting it came at the same time as other sexual abuse, it -- no quinton's we
think. >> a lot of these people who are facilitators were dedicated teachers who devoted their careers to these children per they wanted to protect them. >> the important thing about the story is again it's the same theme of parental love and hope, what can we do to help our child's. this wasn't meant to be a destructive thing. it was about about believing in your kids and wanting to connect with your child. it's a very sad tragic time. >> will take a couple more questions. [inaudible] [inaudible]
[inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] >> can we repeat the question of it. karen will repeat briefly. >> basically the question is what to do if you have an adult with autism and who is to pay for it? [inaudible] >> who wants a mediocre home for their child, right?
[inaudible] exactly. [inaudible] >> that is what we're trying, that is part of the point we're trying to engage people in in this book. which is to look at the past so that we can have a better future. look at the past he never would have imagined that it was so awful and i got so much better. know this next generation of families, because that is who is going to fight for are going to change the world. and they are already out there, people who are here today that are part of this tiny fundraiser , they are trying to change the world by trying to provide services and homes for people that do not have been. we really are, as adults we
figured out, not perfectly but we have really moved by years from where we were 50 years ago. >> for children. >> for children. [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] >> the question was what is going on in new york city in terms of services, particularly through school. >> i can tell you because compared to 20 years ago we have services, we have schools in new york, we have public schools, we have a charter school that the
new york library of autism created for children with autism. when my my son was diagnosed there is nothing in the city. i had to make a home program, had i had to create it from scratch, i had to fight to get the services. i was not even able to get the money back from the state because the people i was working with did not believe in what we were doing. we have come so far in understanding the needs of children with autism, not far enough, but we really are starting to try to support them. part of that again is because parents fought the system and they fought the school system. it is a cycle that we keep doing, how else do they do it? >> last question. >> i've a child that's on the spectrum is 12 years old. at what